"Dominic Thomas" wrote:
Simon wrote:
Domin
The Thomas Covenant series, is, of course, a derivative aberration most
deserving of a place in Oxfam.
Derivative of what, exactly? The "fantasy genre"?
Basically, yes. He seemed to have nicked bits from here, there, and
everywhere. It was a whistle-stop tour of as many fantasy cliches as he
could think of. It read to me like a bad D&D module.
Well, bad and cliched writing are problems throughout the fantasy
genre. Poor Stephen Donaldson is a target for your wrath, but Tanith
Lee or Anne McCaffrey are equally culpable. Even the latest thing,
the Harry Potter books are actually not that well written. The reason
they sell is because they are superb storytelling, not because Ms
Rowling is particularly good with the English language. Like Tolkein
or Donaldson, she has a problem with adjectives: but in Tolkein's
case there were too many, and in Rowling's case there are too few.
But there are very few SF authors whose writing is good. Mostly SF
is carried by storytelling, not by the language. A well known exception
to that is Iain (M) Banks, who seems able to make his way out of the
genre as well as in it. Although I have to admit that my favourite
Banks stories are not SF: I found "Against a Dark Background" hard
work, for example, and prefer things like "The Wasp Factory" or "Whit".
Does that make me a bad person? ;-)
I read it when I was 15. I'd just finished "War and Peace", "Sage of the
Exiles", re-read LOTR yet again, discovered Fighting-Fantasy gamebooks and
basic/expert Dungeons and Dragons. I had nothing better to do. I read all
of
them. Both series. I kept hoping it would redeem itself, and my dogged
bloody-mindedness made me carry on through it.
I'm almost tempted to read them again, because my memory of how much I
hated
them has faded somewhat, and I'm no longer able to insult them with the
vicious clarity I remember feeling they deserved. If I hadn't read them
all,
I wouldn't feel able to insult them at all. This is the same twisted logic
that made me finish "Valis", "Deus Irae" and even "Crash" - a book so vile
it has absolutely no redeeming features whatsoever.
How did you do with "The Night Land", by William Hope Hodgeson? I have
the same kind of determination, but that defeated me. Try it, if you
want a challenge (it's in the
IFIS library).
(I happen to like Thomas Covenant, for all its angsty dreariness.)
I prefer to try and feel at least some sympathy for the main protagonist.
I managed that, eventually, and they were easier going after that. But
he isn't very nice, is he?
On the other hand, you recommended "The Claw of the Conciliator" to me,
and the main protagonist of that really wasn't a very nice person either.
I guess he was a man of action, though.
Then there's Elric ...
For me, the best authors in this list are Joe Haldeman and Ursula le
Guin.
'Fraid I never did get around to le Guin. I expect most of you will now
point fingers and laugh. It was good to see Alfred Bester on there though.
My personal favourite is "Tiger Tiger", which I really should try and get
hold of. I've read it from various libraries, but never owned a copy.
For le Guin, try to avoid getting into "A Wizard of Earthsea", which is
a children's book. (I first heard it on Jackanory, which was a children's
TV program that bridged the gap between modern times and what The
Grandfather in "Princess Bride" described as "when I was your age,
TV was called 'books'". It's probably not worth explaining.) I would
have been maybe eleven years old, which makes it the best part of, erm,
err ... a long time ago, anyway.
Where was I? Oh yes. If you want something to introduce le Guin, and
you are a fan of short stories, try "The Wind's Twelve Quarters". That
ranges from tragic stories like "Semley's Necklace" to humourous stories
like "The Rule of Names". But the thing that always attracts me to
le Guin is the naturalness of her characters. They have real lives,
embedded in real cultures, and in F&SF that's rare.
Be warned, there's often a thread of liberal politics in le Guin's
writings. To sample that, have a look at "Winter's King", for example,
in the same collection.
If you're not a fan of short stories, try "The Word for World is Forest",
or "The Dispossessed". Or even "Always Coming Home" or "Malafrena", which
is not SF. But watch out for that thread of politics!
In passing, I'll note that when I read "Wizard of Earthsea" (or had the
first book read to me, then read "The Tombs of Atuan" and "The Furthest
Shore") even in my strange pre-teen days I felt a strong sense of
injustice for the way one character (Tenar, if you've read the series)
was treated. I thought she was used as a political pawn, and then,
when her usefulness was ended, she was abandoned.
Evidently the author felt the same way, as years later she added a
fourth book, Tehanu, which is about Tenar. It is not quite in keeping
with the rest of the series, not least because it is certainly *not*
a children's book. But the fourth book struck a strong chord with me,
and I felt strongly that I understood why she wrote it. Not everyone
does, though. Some consider it to be a retrofit of the worst possible
sort, which I consider to be missing the point.
To those of you who are Harry Potter fans, read the Earthsea Trilogy,
though. Most of you will enjoy them, especially those who feel fondness
for Norbert. To get a feel for the world, try that short story I
mentioned: "The Rule of Names".
They're all ... in the
IFIS library!
Not sure I consider Silmarillion that significant though.
I'd put it as part of "LotR" myself.
I wouldn't, but I'd say that all the "significance" was in one or the other
book. After the first, there's not much significant about the second.
That's what I think I meant.
But then if it came to it, I'd dump both An-gst Rice and Terry Pratt-chet
from the list to make room for some good stuff.
Ahhh.... but like you can't deny the "significance" of Pratchet, you can't
really deny the significance of Anne Rice on the Vampire Genre. It turned
vampires from the caped fiends of old into the angst-ridden pop stars of
modern day. Like it or loathe it, it's significant. (I happen to like it -
but DO NOT READ "MEMNOCH: THE DEVIL". It's awful. Seriously.)
I shall refrain from expressing my opinion of the Anne Rice phenomenom
on a public list like this. There are limits. But suffice to say that
I for one gave a hearty cheer at the news that Buffy is being canned.
The displacement of good broader fantasy by bad vampire fantasy because
it happens to fit a depressing lifestyle fad is ... oh, now wait, I
said I'd refrain, didn't I?
That's enough being provocative for now. Roll on the next thing!
