library (1997/12/11)

library

Posted by Jenny Gould on 1997/12/11 17:02

When the library first opened, I wondered if it was really reasonable for
Luke to try and run the library on his own. I think he has been doing an
*excellent* job : regular video evenings ( which unfortunately I miss ;-)
plus a fine job of getting us organized for the Star Wars evening. He
managed to harrass the Union into admitting _all_ of the books were still
there. A good freshers fair, with posters et al. Best of all, he has managed
to find a solution to the book racks so that we can fit in the books easier:
ie his father is making some up!

Throughout all this, I have only seen one potential failing: he tries to do
too much. As someone who has years of experience with a busy life, I know
that delegation is often esential. Thus, when the library opened, I wondered
if IFIS wanted a librarian (or two). If you are lending out books, surely the
way to get people involved is a regular commitment to it.

Unfortunately, I don't really know that everyone reads their e-mail (or even
gets it every day). I certainly only got this message about 4.0 pm:

Subject: Library today

Dear Everyone,
The library will not be open today because I
cannot be bothered. If anyone wants a book or anything let me know and I
will get it for you tomorrow. If anyone needs to see me, I will be at
the film tonight which is in the main lecture theatre in founders for
this night only.

I don't blame Luke for not wanting to open the library every week,
especially if very few books have been taken out. However, without a regular
commitment to open it from *someone*, the society cannot do more general
advertising around campus. This list is fine for those switched on to PCs,
but what about all those who are not computer users, but who *could* be keen
readers. If this list is used to announce library closures, especially at
such short notice, I can see such people turning up, and going away
disillusioned if the library is not open when it is *advertised* as being
open. So, how about a roter of people to run the library. That sounds like
much less individual effort, and fairer than Luke doing all the hard work.

Also, I had wondered if having the library opened on Monday afternoons, in
a session before the games evening. What with the overlap of memebers,
people could even put in requests and pick them up from the gaming evening
later. I could do some of these sessions: a perfect opportunity to slack
around catching up with my reading. Of course, I cannot guarantee to clear
every Monday: I work, afer all. However, Steve Dismukes has also said he is
free on Monday afternoons, and would have been happy to do it. You may find
that opening the library on other days will allow people who are tied up on
Thursdays to borrow books.

Certainly, it seems a bit sad if anyone turned up today, being very near
the end of term. So, I would have said I would offer to open the books up on
Monday. Unfortunately, I have a doctors appointment at 4.0pm, so I would be
a bit late. Perhaps Steve will do it: I could lend him my key to do so.

Jenny Gould

---
jenny@

"Share and Enjoy"
-Marketing Division, Sirius Cybernetics Corporation

(The above opinions do not represent a policy statement for or on behalf of

One Chip Solutions)

library

Posted by Steve Dismukes on 1997/12/12 14:26

Previously Jenny Gould wrote:
(...)

Also, I had wondered if having the library opened on Monday
afternoons, in
a session before the games evening. What with the overlap of members,
people could even put in requests and pick them up from the gaming
evening
later. I could do some of these sessions: a perfect opportunity to
slack
around catching up with my reading. Of course, I cannot guarantee to
clear
every Monday: I work, after all. However, Steve Dismukes has also said
he is
free on Monday afternoons, and would have been happy to do it. You may
find
that opening the library on other days will allow people who are tied
up on
Thursdays to borrow books.

I would probably be able to open the library regularly on Mondays after
about 3.30pm or so, if anyone's interested.

Certainly, it seems a bit sad if anyone turned up today, being very
near
the end of term. So, I would have said I would offer to open the books
up on
Monday. Unfortunately, I have a doctors appointment at 4.0pm, so I
would be
a bit late. Perhaps Steve will do it: I could lend him my key to do
so.

Yeah, sure. I'm not doing anything special then. If I could collect it
from you at the Xmas dinner, I could return it on Monday evening. Anyone
who wants to get a book out on Monday come along after 3.30pm. All I
need is for Luke or someone to fill me in on the system of lending.
Alternatively, if you wanted you could e-mail me requests (and you can
now use the funky search thing of Chris Turner's at:
http://www.instituteofcorrection.org.uk/IFIS/booksearch.cgi) and I could bring
them along to the gamesoc meetings. The choice is yours.

Later,

Steve :-)
_

"I conceive of nothing, in religion, science or philosophy, that is more
than the proper thing to wear, for a while." -Charles Fort (1874-1932)

library

Posted by Jonathon Hart on 1997/12/12 23:14

Yes I basiacally agree with what Jenny said. However we did try
advertising it quite extensively around campus previously and no one
turned up then. A good idea may be to put something in RWAV about it, as
that tends to get given out to most of the membership (hint, hint Mr.
Lyth)

Jonathon Hart

library

Posted by Chris L on 1997/12/15 09:35

----------
From: Lyth Chris
Sent: 15 December 1997 09:35
To: 'Hart J.D'
Subject: RE: library

If I get an article on the subject then fine

----------
From: Hart J.D
Sent: 12 December 1997 23:14
To: c=GB;a=ATTmail;p=MAFF400;o=MAFF;ou1=SMTP;dda:RFC-822=ifis-chat(a)cimio.co.uk;; 'Jenny Gould'
Subject: RE: library

Yes I basiacally agree with what Jenny said. However we did try
advertising it quite extensively around campus previously and no one
turned up then. A good idea may be to put something in RWAV about it, as
that tends to get given out to most of the membership (hint, hint Mr.
Lyth)

Jonathon Hart

library

Posted by Simon Richardson on 1997/12/15 12:02

In article <"/GUID:83BA1622BF73D111BB50000000000001*"@MHS>, Lyth Chris <Chris.C.Lyth@> wrote:

----------
From: Lyth Chris
Sent: 15 December 1997 09:35
To: 'Hart J.D'
Subject: RE: library

If I get an article on the subject then fine

----------
From: Hart J.D
Sent: 12 December 1997 23:14
To: c=GB;a=ATTmail;p=MAFF400;o=MAFF;ou1=SMTP;dda:RFC-822=ifis-chat(a)cimio.co.uk;; 'Jenny Gould'
Subject: RE: library

Yes I basiacally agree with what Jenny said. However we did try
advertising it quite extensively around campus previously and no one
turned up then. A good idea may be to put something in RWAV about it, as
that tends to get given out to most of the membership (hint, hint Mr.
Lyth)

Jonathon Hart

For those of you not used to this strange way of quoting, Chris is replying
to Jonathon, not the other way around.

What I am going to suggest would at least work for those of us who are
capable of using the Internet (which is all of you, I assume - unless
someone is reading this to you.)

A little while ago, there was a suggestion to put the IFIS library list on
the web-page. (Is it there ... pause while I start Netscape ... coo, it
is!) You can see the book list, and even search for books by title or
author.

What we can't do is search for "a book we would like". Or even "I like
Pratchett (or R K Lafferty, or Anne McCaffery, or even, so help me, David
Eddings) - find me something else that I would like." I assume a service
like that would help those who would wish to use the library, but find the
array of unknown books intimidating. I *do* know many of the IFIS books,
and so do other people - and I can tell you, there is some unmitigated shite
in there along with some truly excellent work.

Now it is not beyond the wit of programmers to come up with a solution to
this. The solution is a search page that says "I like [the colour of magic]
by [terry pratchett], what else might I like" and gives you all the other
Pratchetts, as well as people like Rankin, series like the Xanth books and
other similar authors or series. This does not mean asking a computer to
read all the IFIS books - it means having a related page where IFIS members
enter groups of books that they think are similar. Then the computer
program looks through the groups to disgorge this information.

The programming side of it I am willing to work on myself - writing CGI
scripts is something I can manage. The questions really are: would such a
facility be useful? and would people be willing to tick off books into
groups?

Just my thoughts...

Simon

---
"This too is meaningless, a chasing after the wind" -Ecclesiastes 4:16

simon@ | Not affiliated to any religion
simon@ | Not affiliated to any politics
H (+44/0)1784 431998 | Not affiliated to any ideology
W (+44/0)1784 434568 (GMT/BST) | What does that make me?

"I have been asked to point out, as if you couldn't guess, that my rantings
are not the opinions of One Chip Solutions. So now you know, don't you..?"

library

Posted by Chris Turner on 1997/12/15 12:24

Previously, simon@ wrote....

[Snip]

For those of you not used to this strange way of quoting, Chris is replying
to Jonathon, not the other way around.

yes - it's evil and satanic *8).

What I am going to suggest would at least work for those of us who are
capable of using the Internet (which is all of you, I assume - unless
someone is reading this to you.)

A little while ago, there was a suggestion to put the IFIS library list on
the web-page. (Is it there ... pause while I start Netscape ... coo, it
is!) You can see the book list, and even search for books by title or
author.

Yup - I put the search thing up a week or so ago - the book list has been
there for er...well as far as I can remember (at least a month *8).

What we can't do is search for "a book we would like". Or even "I like
Pratchett (or R K Lafferty, or Anne McCaffery, or even, so help me, David
Eddings) - find me something else that I would like." I assume a service
like that would help those who would wish to use the library, but find the
array of unknown books intimidating. I *do* know many of the IFIS books,
and so do other people - and I can tell you, there is some unmitigated shite
in there along with some truly excellent work.

Now it is not beyond the wit of programmers to come up with a solution to
this. The solution is a search page that says "I like [the colour of magic]
by [terry pratchett], what else might I like" and gives you all the other
Pratchetts, as well as people like Rankin, series like the Xanth books and
other similar authors or series. This does not mean asking a computer to
read all the IFIS books - it means having a related page where IFIS members
enter groups of books that they think are similar. Then the computer
program looks through the groups to disgorge this information.

The programming side of it I am willing to work on myself - writing CGI
scripts is something I can manage. The questions really are: would such a
facility be useful? and would people be willing to tick off books into
groups?

Yeah - I think this would be a great idea. I can certainly help catagorise
books, I could even do the programming side (might be a good idea since I'm
to blame for the current search system).

Chris

chris@ #include <stddisclaimer.h> http://www.instituteofcorrection.org.uk/

"So this is really me? A no-style gimbo with teeth druids could use as a
place of worship" - Duaine Dibley (Red Dwarf - "Back to Reality")

library

Posted by Jonathon Hart on 1997/12/15 16:26

Simon's idea sound reasonably good but seems to me to be a lot
of hard work. However: a. if someones wants to do it then thats not a
problem, b. I don't know anything about computers so I may be talking
bollocks here.

Jon

P.S. what's wrong with David Eddings Simon?

library

Posted by Adam Hattrell on 1997/12/16 09:55

What we can't do is search for "a book we would like". Or even "I like
Pratchett (or R K Lafferty, or Anne McCaffery, or even, so help me, David
Eddings) - find me something else that I would like." I assume a service
like that would help those who would wish to use the library, but find the
array of unknown books intimidating. I *do* know many of the IFIS books,
and so do other people - and I can tell you, there is some unmitigated shite
in there along with some truly excellent work.

[Simon's programming solution]

Well an interesting solution and if you want to code it feel free,
however, if people want a more immediate, personal and friendly
service there is an alternative available. Believe it or not,
this mailing list already has this capability.

The interface is similar to your proposed web search engine,
but the language parser (for the most part) is capable of
understanding English. So your request would go along the lines
of:

I like David Eddings, (though I was dropped on the head repeatedly
as a child) can someone suggest some other drivel for me to read.

It also has the facility to give multiple reviews of specific books.
The request for this one is slightly more complex but goes along the
lines of:

Has anyone read C.S Lewis's book, That Hideous Strength? Could you
give me a brief review?

Give it a try. You'll be amazed at the results.

Later,

Adam Hattrell, Support, Cimio Ltd. adam@

library

Posted by Simon Richardson on 1997/12/16 11:42

In article <E0xhtii-0005pA-00@>, Adam Hattrell <adam@> wrote:

What we can't do is search for "a book we would like". Or even "I like
Pratchett (or R K Lafferty, or Anne McCaffery, or even, so help me, David
Eddings) - find me something else that I would like." I assume a service
like that would help those who would wish to use the library, but find the
array of unknown books intimidating. I *do* know many of the IFIS books,
and so do other people - and I can tell you, there is some unmitigated shite
in there along with some truly excellent work.

[Simon's programming solution]

Well an interesting solution and if you want to code it feel free,

I am. It's terrifyingly simple. Watch this space.

however, if people want a more immediate, personal and friendly
service there is an alternative available. Believe it or not,
this mailing list already has this capability.

[...]

Has anyone read C.S Lewis's book, That Hideous Strength? Could you
give me a brief review?

No. I have seen it around but I haven't got around to it. I read
"Perelandria" a few weeks ago, having read "Out of the Silent Planet" many
many years back, but I have to ration my reading and playing of computer
games if I want to have any sort of life. It's on my reading list for
Christmas. Obviously it is a sequel to the "Out of the Silent Planet" and
"Perelandria" novels that describe the main character's visits to Mars and
Venus. They both have similar spiritual echoes to the Narnia books,
although they are intended for adults, not children.

If you like that sort of thing you might give Charles Williams a try -
although he is NOT IN THE LIBRARY. :-( You might also give some of Philip
Jose Farmer ("The Alley God") or Dion Fortune ("Moon Magic", or "The
Goat-Foot God") a try, since they tickle the same intellectual spot for me.
Dion Fortune is not in the Library either. But be warned - they are neither
of them Christian writers, if that matters.

Give it a try. You'll be amazed at the results.

You are absolutely right, of course. The amount of information available
about the library is pretty high, and at this point I'd only be duplicating
existing knowledge. But new people come along, and (surprising as it might
seem to some of us) old people do go. It would be nice to leave some of
their knowledge behind them.

Also, half the books I'd recommend are not in the library. And out of
print, for that matter. :-( :-( :-(

Simon

---
"This too is meaningless, a chasing after the wind" -Ecclesiastes 4:16

simon@ | Not affiliated to any religion
simon@ | Not affiliated to any politics
H (+44/0)1784 431998 | Not affiliated to any ideology
W (+44/0)1784 434568 (GMT/BST) | What does that make me?

"I have been asked to point out, as if you couldn't guess, that my rantings
are not the opinions of One Chip Solutions. So now you know, don't you..?"